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Old 05-01-2017, 02:49 PM   #1
Taylor
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Jealousy

Hey everybody.
I havnt participated for a while but I am having some real trouble with this bit of karma I have seemed to have acquired through incarnations and this present one and I'd love to get some devotee perspectives.
I have been married now for three years to my wife who is also a devotee.
I consider my marriage to be a truly God ordained one. A marriage based off of divine love and spiritual ideals.
Those things considered, I still find myself battling intense jealousy and fear of rejection. I find myself constantly obsessing about if my wife is harboring desires for others and if she still finds me desirable. When we talk she often gets frustrated because she reassures me this isn't the case, but my paranoia gets the better of me and I end up trying the get the nitty gritty details about her thoughts and feeling. I wonder if occasional fantasizing about others is just a normal enevitability in any relationship, or if this signifies a deeper problem.
Of course, as Master says, jealousy can deteriorate a relationship so you can understand my fears of doing that as well.
Does anyone have some suggestions and insights to this crippling emotion and type of consciousness? Thanks and blessings.
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Old 05-01-2017, 05:13 PM   #2
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I don't have any advice (single, never married), but if there is someone who does not experience this I am interested to know of them! Of course, I can relate to what you are feeling. My opinion, which may not be worth much, is that it is completely inevitable stuff. In my mind, all people in relationships obviously find people besides their partner desirable and charming. Harboring those feelings, though? Seems a lot less likely. You may be very insecure, though. There are therapists in the world - not sure how much they could help. Someone may have some advice coming for you related to Kriya Yoga. All the best.

P.S. This advice just came to me, but probably won't help much: you could try to remind yourself that your partner is not your possession but instead belongs to God. That is, in fact, the truth.

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Old 05-01-2017, 09:13 PM   #3
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Thanks Brock for the kind and helpful thoughts on the issue! I have thought about therapy though not sure it has felt right just yet for that. Not sure why exactly. I know SRF condones and often will suggest such a measure, but at this point I'm still resistant to it for unknown reasons.
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Old 05-01-2017, 09:29 PM   #4
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I don't blame you. I am resistant to therapy, too. Mainly because I don't really trust that they'd be able to help and, even worse, could torture you with a bunch of nonsense. Plus, I know people who see therapists and don't seem to get better. I did go to one a couple of times but just didn't feel nsync with the guy. If I ever decided to go again, I'd definitely shop around.
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Old 05-04-2017, 05:31 AM   #5
mccoy
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Quote:
I have been married now for three years to my wife who is also a devotee.
I'm happy about that and congratulations in delate to you and your spouse (is she Caitlin??)

Quote:
I still find myself battling intense jealousy and fear of rejection. I find myself constantly obsessing about if my wife is harboring desires for others and if she still finds me desirable. When we talk she often gets frustrated because she reassures me this isn't the case, but my paranoia gets the better of me and I end up trying the get the nitty gritty details about her thoughts and feeling. I wonder if occasional fantasizing about others is just a normal enevitability in any relationship, or if this signifies a deeper problem.
Of course, as Master says, jealousy can deteriorate a relationship so you can understand my fears of doing that as well.
Does anyone have some suggestions and insights to this crippling emotion and type of consciousness? Thanks and blessings.
Excessive jealousy really can deteriorate a relationship.

First, as it appears it is deteriorating your peace of mind
Second, it may deteriorate you wife's peace of mind, since she may feel monitored and controlled with no reason whatsoever and suffer by proxy the vibrations emanated by your stressed mind.

I find myself sometimes on the receiving end of jealousy, and it's not always funny.

I believe the situation may reach a degree of seriousness, but have no really very practical suggestions.

You may ask yourself if there is a real reason to be jealous or if it is just a fear of an eventuality.

If there is no reason and if your wife's reassurances are genuine (but most probably there is no doubt to believe her), then your obsession may be founded on some conscious or unconscious inferiority complex. There is no denying you are not exhibiting a huge confidence and self-esteem, or else the issue has assumed disproportionate dimensions in your mind and you are building up a dimension where you believe you should assume the abilities of a superhero to be worthy of your wife.

I'm just playing at doing the psychologist here but I'm not one of course, but, from what you describe, and if this situation has been in existance for a long time, then by all means you should perhaps consult a professional help. Someone with experience, jealousy is not an unusual affliction and an experienced psychologist sure has treated quite a few cases of jealousy to be of some help.

Otherwise you should try and find some way to get out of that mental maze, by intellect or prayer. It also depends on time, such mental stress also afflicts physical health deleteriously. Mental stress causes for example an increased secretion of Cortisol which causes hyperinsulinaemia and other undesirable physical manifestations.

As brock suggested, in case you choose professional help, as usual make sure to ask for advice about some with the right credentials and experience.

All the best!
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Old 05-07-2017, 07:14 AM   #6
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I cannot thank you all enough for taking the time to thoughtfully consider the issues here. I'm thinking more and more some couple of personal therapy might be beneficial to me. At times I feel like I'm turning a corner with the jealousy and other times it feels like back at square one.

Mccoy, you gave some great food for thought. And yes her name is Caitlin.
You were spot on about the feeling of needing to a superhero, for fear that I just can't measure up to other men. And your right, I have developed these self esteem issues you mentioned. It's karma I havnt had to deal with in past years, and now it's in full force.

I know what I have to do (more or less), but mostly it seems I just have to meditate and endure.
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Old 05-07-2017, 08:07 AM   #7
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Hi Taylor - thank you for sharing this issue, one that probably affects most people at one time or another.

Some thoughts: Luckily jealousy is not something I experienced in my romantic partnerships (the last one being a marriage of over 20 years). My partners were not jealous people, either. Very liberating! Working on Self and the Couple is challenging enough without that. However, in recent times I found myself quite smitten with a person and experienced incredible jealousy! Ha ha. Very humbling. Did not know I had it in me - it was terribly distasteful. Here is what I realized - though I am still processing this lesson, am not certain about it: Jealousy comes from a place of imbalance within ourselves. When we partner up with people, we are subconsciously seeking in them something we have repressed within ourselves - something we need to uncover, develop and explore. Positive and negative traits. When our partner already is and provides to us whatever that thing is, we feel in balance and harmonious - but at the same time, deep down, we 'know' this is cheating a bit, because rather that fleshing out that aspect of our personality, we let them 'be it' for us. We become attached to them, as if they are an extension of ourselves. They are not. When we feel secure, jealousy is not an issue. Not just secure in the relationship, but secure in our own beings. I think I experienced uncharacteristic jealousy because I am temporarrily in an imbalanced place. Rather than obsess about the partner and seek validation, it may be better for a time to obsess about ourselves - do the inner shadow work to comprehend what qualities we lack, and strive to develop them - to become as 'whole' as we can possibly be. That way, instead of looking to our partners to provide us with what we lack (an impossible job over time!) we look to them for sharing the journey with - two souls not facing each other intensley, but rather standing side by side - looking outward together at the life experience. A final thought, particularly for men though not exclusively - it seems to me the sex urge for men is very possessive. It is common to become fixated on a woman once a bed had been shared. Sexuality is also something we come to believe we NEED another person for. Without them, our subconscious panics. Does not have to be this way at all. If you find yourself objectifying your wife, resist the tendency! Affirm to yourself that you are a being of God in a human body. Your wife is also. Of all the things you will share, your bodies are the least of the gifts - though still a gift, of course! Ha ha. Hope this all makes sense.

On Marriage
Kahlil Gibran

You were born together, and together you shall be forevermore.
You shall be together when the white wings of death scatter your days.
Ay, you shall be together even in the silent memory of God.
But let there be spaces in your togetherness,
And let the winds of the heavens dance between you.


Love one another, but make not a bond of love:
Let it rather be a moving sea between the shores of your souls.
Fill each other's cup but drink not from one cup.
Give one another of your bread but eat not from the same loaf
Sing and dance together and be joyous, but let each one of you be alone,
Even as the strings of a lute are alone though they quiver with the same music.


Give your hearts, but not into each other's keeping.
For only the hand of Life can contain your hearts.
And stand together yet not too near together:
For the pillars of the temple stand apart,
And the oak tree and the cypress grow not in each other's shadow.
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Old 05-07-2017, 10:20 AM   #8
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Thank you delsol. I like the thought of "obsessing" over myself and development rather then on my wife's thoughts and feelings.

We both got married pretty young, myself being 24 at the time and her being 22. I have had a few partners before her but she really has only experienced a serious relationship with myself. The combined stress and lack of spiritual practice has seemed to open a door of haunting thoughts for her about not experiencing what it's like to be with other people before she "settled down".
And once the mind believes it needs an experience to "get past" something and resolve it, that it becomes extremely difficult to dislodge it without letting it come to fruition. I worry this feeling of an "incomplete" life experience will plague us down the years.
I've even toyed with the idea of letting her go off and do whatever she thinks she needs to do to get past this. But that feels so wrong to all my core beliefs and the vows we took in front of Master and will only lead down a darker road.
Is this something that goes away with age? With time? Do most people who marry early and there first partner experience this?

I realize there is only so much help you kind devotees and give but it feels a tad better to share. I know I just have to "do the work" and endure but this feeling of insecurity and unsafeness in the marriage is a turmoil I have never felt before.
And I also know my mind makes it probably considerably worse the. The situation dictates. But that's my current karma I guess.
Love and blessings.
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Old 05-08-2017, 08:04 AM   #9
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Ah - I see, this is a slightly different dynamic than what I understood before. I feel for you both.

Have no answers - each person is so different, but can share that when I was with my first partner (ages 14 - 23) I had no prior experience either, and only occasionally wondered with mild curiosity what it might be like to be with someone else. Ironically, we would have married around the same ages you did - but it was he who started wondering what (or whom) he was missing out on. I pulled back so he could 'explore'. By the time he realized he really did wish to be with me for life, I had moved on. Here's the thing; everything is exactly as it should be, right? You cannot control her thoughts, but you can listen and try to understand without immediate judgement. She is human, and it would be natural to wonder. Don't needle her about her thoughts, but create an open atmosphere ripe for sharing and discussion if and when she is ready. Difficult! You have to build trust - nurture the rapport. You can do it. Marriage is full of learning experiences like this, I believe. There is no 'destiny' - only karmic opportunity. All you can control is your own reaction to each development, and try to choose genuine Love. Focus on other things together. Nurture her, be aware of her needs (physical and emotional) - she will likely admire you even more for it and come to know more deeply why she chose you. Best wishes - just food for thought. I am no expert.

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Old 05-08-2017, 03:13 PM   #10
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Taylor,
Have faith, fear not. Let go and let God. Easy to say, hard to do. But try it. What have you to lose? It sounds like fear of divorce and your desire to be married to a fellow devotee is getting the best of you. While the marriage appears idyllic, sometimes the more you tighten up on something, the more it feels like you are trying to control it, instead of yourself. Maybe going on separate SRF retreats for men and women, away from one another to meditate on this situation may help both of you?
My point is to not let your fear and desire CONTROL you, which makes you do regrettable things in hindsight. Let go of this control. It is possible that your marriage can end. But it is certain that through it all and anything else, remind yourself that God is in control and is looking out for you (and Caitlin).
In my own personal life, it's been a transition of rethinking of what's important in life... I used to think that being married with children was the holy grail, pre-SRF. Now, I'm married with children and I'm beginning to realize that's it's only temporary gifts from God to show my strengths as well as expose my weaknesses, and to learn to behave and evolve my personality and consciousness beyond the marital mundane, ups and downs. After 3-4 years of being with my wife, I am just learning to "love" her in all her glory and dark sides, as opposed to loving MY check-the-box image of her, which is NOT who she is in reality. I'm sure she feels the same way about me.
I sincerely believe that in the end God alone matters. When life's good, we tend to forget this and only cry/pray to God when life's bad. Try that "what would Jesus do" analysis on your life and meditate alone and away from her presence to see how He can guide you.
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Old 05-10-2017, 05:00 AM   #11
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Taylor, now that you've been more specific, maybe your reaction is not so much excessive. I mean, I sure wouldn't manage to be unperturbed in your place.
Even though it's all in the hypothetical realm, so the psychology of it is really convoluted.
Anyway, it is clear that you need to come out of that unordinately stressful mental state, not a fun thing to live with.
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Old 05-14-2017, 07:45 AM   #12
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Triguybos, wise counsel indeed. Those things you spoke of I understand intellectually and faithfully though I am prone to forget my faithful understanding of it more often. I think we will go on a retreat together, separately. We both talked recently with Sister Brahmani at our temple and she gave incredible insight as to the psychology behind these thoughts. I've gained an understanding of this I hadn't previously had. She also counseled that it's "the wise ones" that go to therapy when needed so I think I will pursue that avenue as well for some more "tools" to help us both deal, and understand more fully the psychology of it. I love what you said about learning to love the one your with AS THEY ARE. Not putting on them them a fantasy ideal that's in your head about how you "want" them to be but accepting the karma we both face as a team.
I will continue to strive for the higher wisdom that allows a "direct correspondence with reality" as Our Master says. And I see that it is God that is showing us that it is Him alone that is our perfect comfort and companion. Thank you and Blessing to you and your Wife.

Mccoy, you were right I belive that my reaction wasn't so excessive. Sister confirmed that as well, which gave me a validation of feeling that was very cool comforting. Though after talking we the wife one on one she also felt that the issues arnt as dire as my mind likes to make it out to be. It is just clear that real effort needs to be made on both our parts so we don't let this thing get to far out of hand. She indicated that my wife entered marriage early and her teenage years were fraught with problems at home which probably stunted that developmental stage most teenagers go through at that time with friends and boys etc. apparently this isn't uncommon for people to skip stages of development or go through them out of order. This understanding of this has freed me a great deal of thinking it's something IM doing or that I can't be for her. These things naturally come about if your development is stunted at various stages. Sure, it still is quite difficult to deal with but that is life no? So onward and upward!
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Old 05-18-2017, 12:21 PM   #13
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Best wishes to you and yours, man.

I realize and appreciate how my wife and I balance each other out with respect to our strengths and flaws. Her strengths are my flaws, while my strengths are her flaws. Believe me, our flaws can be overwhelming at times. Nevertheless, I'm convinced that He's speaking to and guiding me through her, to help me balance myself, so that I can ultimately "be still and know" Him. It is true that opposites attract because they balance each other and help each other develop in him/herself which is lacking.

In a speech on one of his birthdays, Master said that man brings out the hidden reason in woman while woman brings out the hidden feeling in man. True and true when it comes to my wife and I! I hope that we continue to learn from and love each other, and I sincerely hope you and yours can do the same. Each individual, whether man or woman, seeks a healthy balance of reason and feeling.

You nailed it on the head... It is amazing how He "talks" to us, be it via our significant others, children, strangers, parents, friends, etc. We only have to perk our ears up and tune into His message that's hidden in plain sight.

Hope you both enjoy your respective retreats. I think I will ask mine to come with me to this year's Convocation.
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