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Old 02-02-2018, 09:47 PM   #281
khitomer
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The current general population level of Self-realization is too low for spiritual socialism, even SRF had to scratch this from original "aims and ideals". Any little slip up (any type of sexual misconduct by any one member) can be sensationalized publicly and the work would be in jeopardy. A colony with married couples and close quarters would allow for sexual misconduct, thus they had to cut that out and take the most conservative position to avoid any such outcome that could threaten the whole work. What looks like to me.

So what about the cultural Marxism? Did you read the article about the wiki entry? Did you read the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy entry about critical theory originating with the Frankfurt School of Marxists? Did you read the other info? Did you read the excerpts from Marcuse's letters? What are your thoughts about all that?
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Old 02-02-2018, 11:32 PM   #282
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I'm not a fan of tricking people, but this goes to show how far Trump's biggest supporters were willing to go in support of their candidate (ie, casualties of CD). If libertarian is ideal for spiritual socialism to grow, are there any limits of means to justify the end?

The Republican Party in the U.S. suppresses citizens of their individual liberties (other than guns), the hallmark of Libertarianism, exactly what is necessary to learn lessons, learn from mistakes, work out karma, etc. If so, how can anyone claiming he is all for Libertarianism and at same time support the likes of candidates represented in the GOP (Republican Party)?

I just realized the big guy in t-shirt is the Republican Michael Moore.

These kinds of "look how stoopid they are" vids are numerous on both sides. Have you seen the ones where liberals are told certain policies are Trump's and they bag the hell out of them and him, only to be told they were actually Obama policies? And vice versa, where they're told they're Obama policies so they bow down, only to be told they're actually Trump policies? Pretty Hillaryous.





I never said I think Trump is a true libertarian, but some of his moves are definitely more on the side of less government regulation/interference than liberal policies. And all things considered, hes a damn sight better choice than Hillary wouldve been. Thats really what it comes down to.

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Old 02-06-2018, 03:44 PM   #283
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So what about the cultural Marxism? Did you read the article about the wiki entry? Did you read the Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy entry about critical theory originating with the Frankfurt School of Marxists? Did you read the other info? Did you read the excerpts from Marcuse's letters? What are your thoughts about all that?
I spent half the day yesterday and today reading all this academic information, it was mentally draining. I've been processing all the data to make some assessment and reply.

"According to these theorists, a “critical” theory may be distinguished from a “traditional” theory according to a specific practical purpose: a theory is critical to the extent that it seeks human emancipation," “to liberate human beings from the circumstances that enslave them” (linked )

According to this archived historical background of "Critical Theory" strictly reading the definition I would argue the Science of Religion or Bhagavad Gita lays out the "critical" theory of liberating the soul from circumstances that enslave it, but I think what they mean to focus on is the freedom from being exploited by fellow humans, and creating conditions to reduce or eliminate this. They don't go deeper in the underlying causes like Master does. The school's aim is for promotion primarily of individual free will, or liberty... as further explained here:

"In light of the practical goal of identifying and overcoming all the circumstances that limit human freedom, the explanatory goal could be furthered only through interdisciplinary research that includes psychological, cultural, and social dimensions, as well as institutional forms of domination."

Quote:
"[T]hey never developed any unified theory or collective political agenda with regard to the United States." So, what Wikipedia wants me to believe is that this most recent group of critical theorists infiltrating gaming with the goal of censure is not a collective political agenda?

Sorry Jimmy, you're never getting another penny from me."
So we have redditor u/sneakywiki disagreeing with the current wiki page assessment that while some individual Frankfurt School philosophers did have an agenda to influence Western and specifically American society (targeting younger minds at universities) with their brand of philosophy (like Master Yogananda did with his message or anyone with their new brand of philosophy to a new audience), and later influenced more recent individuals to push for (some aspect of gaming PC culture related to feminism apparently - idk the specifics), the Frankfurt school however doesn't seem to have a unified theory or collective political agenda with regard to the United States.

The school focused on a specific philosophical objective, some individuals (one prominent Marcuse) decided to come to the States to influence students. There are several aspects of "PC" culture only one of which is feminism, which looks like is part of this particular gaming debate. But do you think that black Americans civil rights driving force and influence was Marcuse/Frankfurt School of Cultural Marxism? I don't think so. If we study the history of the timeline of this movement it's on its way before Marcuse came along and making progress, so not originating from Frankfurt School of Critical Theory, or at least I have not seen the connection made there. It shows more of an homegrown movement.

However the connection to feminism, granted there appear to some influence by this one student of the school in particular who came lecturing onto U.S campuses in the 60s. How much? I'm not so sure it's all Critical Theory. From what I see living here for three decades, that homes require both parents to work full time due to growing lack of raise in salary vs inflation. The increased leveraging of corporations over the workers, along with globalization, has steadily resulting in an ever growing need to work more, with more debt, less savings, even to the point of having to make the women work as much or more than the male partner. The likes of TrickyNicky like to put the blame on Frankfurt and Critical Theory, but what I see it's more to do with the very thing Critical Theory would aim at preventing, and appears to have failed so in America. The exploitation of workers is creeping in, with the weakening of labor unions starting with Republican hero Ronald Reagan, along with the advent of the internet, globalization, decimating the middle class/work class, out bid cheap labor, while maintaining and increasing high cost of living.

Unregulated business policy pushed by the Republican Party, ironically, looks like the bigger factor in modern day push for equal pay than influence by Critical Theory/Frankfurt School. Jimmy is getting ongoing couple dollars from me.

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Old 02-06-2018, 04:35 PM   #284
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Republicans dont push unregulated business policy at all. They just dont want to over-regulate and bog down the free market to ridiculous proportions. Considering it is government that enables the cronysim, politicians would best serve ethical business interests by regulating themselves instead.

If you simply go by the words used to label Critical Theory, and apply it arbitrarily to anything you can logically deduce it potentially referring to (instead of what it has been specifically applied to define viz a viz Frankfurt School), then I could do the same by taking the name Self-Realization to mean anything I want it to, like seeing an apple and realizing within myself that it is indeed an apple. But of course you and I are aware of the meaning, as Master meant it, to refer to the attainment of samadhi, and the recognition of the unity of soul and Spirit.

My point in linking you that stuff was to show there is indeed a connection between identity politcs/sjw concerns and Critical Theory as originated by the Frankfurt School intellectuals and academics, despite wiki claiming it to be a conspiracy theory. The very basis of picking apart western cultural constructs from the viewpoint of how best to do away with them, following a Marxist dialectic, makes it inherently Marxist (materialistically socialist). You can see in Marcuse's writings, how his entire deconstruction of gender roles in the cause of feminism is tied to a Marxist dialectic (of class warfare translated in this case to 'minority versus status quo').

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Old 02-06-2018, 04:43 PM   #285
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I never said I think Trump is a true libertarian, but some of his moves are definitely more on the side of less government regulation/interference than liberal policies. And all things considered, hes a damn sight better choice than Hillary wouldve been. Thats really what it comes down to.
We disagree with government regulation. I'm for regulation within limits, that still allow from a wide array of poorer and richer classes, just without the far extremes.

These are not nearly as funny as Triumphs I find. From 6:30 on here he punks Clinton supporters too.

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Old 02-06-2018, 04:53 PM   #286
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Master's suggestion in the World Crisis talk was that government give a freer hand to business, and educate the people in how to make money. He did not argue for a redistribution of wealth, which is decidedly undemocratic. What needs to be tackled if there is a wider than previous gap between rich and poor, is to keep on top of inflation, which affects the cost of living. Who or what regulates inflation? The government, and government through the Fed.
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Old 02-06-2018, 05:37 PM   #287
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This accurately describes?

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Old 02-06-2018, 05:49 PM   #288
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Thats pretty silly tbh. If you look for sophistry and antagonism, you will find it.

You can however read the words of the Frankfurt School Marxists themselves, as I said earlier, and find all kinds of confirmation that they were the driving force behind Critical Theory inculcating Marxist dialectic in western academia.

If youre only interested in childish mocking and dissembling, Im not interested in continuing a conversation with you.
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Old 02-06-2018, 05:56 PM   #289
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Democratic Party

This was interesting reading, how the parties have evolved from original.

"The Democratic Party evolved from the Jeffersonian Republican or Democratic-Republican Party organized by Thomas Jefferson and James Madison in opposition to the Federalist Party of Alexander Hamilton and John Adams. The party favored republicanism, a weak federal government, states' rights, agrarian interests (especially Southern planters) and strict adherence to the Constitution; it opposed a national bank, close ties to Great Britain and business and banking interests. The Democratic-Republican Party, came to power in the election of 1800."

Gold standard

With all the hoopla from Ron Paul about a Gold Standard being the best, there are many disadvantages. Not to say tying USD to trading oil wasn't the right solution either, (actually much worse considering long term consequences) but the Gold standard on it's own also has weaknesses.

"In 2012 a poll of 40 U.S. economists in the IGM Economic Experts Panel found that none of them agreed with a claim that a return to the gold standard would result in "price-stability and employment outcomes [that] would be better for the average American." The panel of polled economists included past Nobel Prize winners, former economic advisers to both Republican and Democratic presidents, and senior faculty from Harvard, Chicago, Stanford, MIT, and other well-known research universities. (The specific question posed to the economists was: "If the US replaced its discretionary monetary policy regime with a gold standard, defining a 'dollar' as a specific number of ounces of gold, the price-stability and employment outcomes would be better for the average American.") [3]

The economist Allan H. Meltzer of Carnegie Mellon University presented arguments against Ron Paul's advocacy of the gold standard since the 1970s. He sometimes summarizes his opposition by stating simply, "[W]e don’t have the gold standard. It’s not because we don’t know about the gold standard, it’s because we do.
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Old 02-06-2018, 06:00 PM   #290
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Thats pretty silly tbh. If you look for sophistry and antagonism, you will find it.

You can however read the words of the Frankfurt School Marxists themselves, as I said earlier, and find all kinds of confirmation that they were the driving force behind Critical Theory inculcating Marxist dialectic in western academia.

If youre only interested in childish mocking and dissembling, Im not interested in continuing a conversation with you.
tbh I wasn't trying to be mocking here (though it may come off like it), it was a legitimate reference on wiki. I guess they are compromised/bias. I'm new to studying the concept.

I'm ready to shut down online forum discussion, at least take a long break anyway, but wanted to reply to your comments earlier.
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Old 02-06-2018, 06:38 PM   #291
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Gold standard represents verifiable wealth, not inflated currency leading to exponential national debt and a bubble that cant be adequately diagnosed until it bursts. You can find 'expert' support for anything; the burning question should always be, what is the truth of something, not perpetuating an exercise in confirming own bias.
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Old 02-07-2018, 02:40 PM   #292
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Gold standard represents verifiable wealth, not inflated currency leading to exponential national debt and a bubble that cant be adequately diagnosed until it bursts. You can find 'expert' support for anything; the burning question should always be, what is the truth of something, not perpetuating an exercise in confirming own bias.
this is true
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Old 02-11-2018, 08:51 AM   #293
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I'm not really interested in politics nor do I claim to understand it especially not US politics. I don't know if anyone is interested in the following article about university professors in the US.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...MCNEWEML6619I2
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Old 02-11-2018, 10:06 AM   #294
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I'm not really interested in politics nor do I claim to understand it especially not US politics. I don't know if anyone is interested in the following article about university professors in the US.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...MCNEWEML6619I2
Leftist McCarthyism:

https://downtrend.com/robertgehl/lef...ve-professors/


Fighting alleged Right Wing Fascism by being a Left Wing Fascist

http://canadafreepress.com/article/i...ascist-fascism


Marxism in universities:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...urn-of-marxism

https://www.thecollegefix.com/post/26717/



"Professor" Obama:

https://nalert.blogspot.com/2008/02/...y-marxist.html


Cultural Marxism moving right along:

https://www.crisismagazine.com/2015/...disintegration


The great deceiver:

"Cultural Marxism is spiritual, even under a different banner."

and among some SRF members:

"It's part of the Dwapara Yuga enlightenment evolution"
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Old 02-11-2018, 01:35 PM   #295
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"Cultural Marxism is spiritual, even under a different banner."

and among some SRF members:

"It's part of the Dwapara Yuga enlightenment evolution"
Nonsense - sorry!
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Old 02-11-2018, 02:58 PM   #296
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Nonsense - sorry!
Some board members here, (and elsewhere) have embraced "social justice" Cultural Marxist activist movements and explained that those movements are part of the emerging Dwapara Yuga spiritual consciousness.

You having no understanding that some SRF members embrace Cultural Marxist principles and precepts, but under a different name, "social justice" is unfortunate.

Sorry !

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Old 02-11-2018, 07:01 PM   #297
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Woops! Haven't really been following your politics threads and posts, but I should've guessed the article would get your candle to flame up even in the snow! Lucky you, Jacko, to be surrounded by so much snow! God bless America, God bless all the continents; our little planet earth and our universe! And thank you, God, for snow!

Just wondering, my husband says he doesn't want to go to Los Angeles because there are 3 million people below the poverty line. Is this social justice marxism or just another of maya's obstacles so I don't get to convocation? (or maybe just a fear of planes) lol

Surely Guruji never intended for us to have the same political opinions? People from different cultures, countries, languages and religions all coming together and meditating in silence, mentally bowing before God and Guru....

....quite a miracle! A first-timer from France told us about her experience at convocation....all these noisy, friendly Americans and others, and then suddenly a room of complete silence and hundreds of people meditating...just extraordinary!

Long live different political opinions - as long as we meditate and keep thoughts of peace upper most!

Love you all!
IDF
PS. Are you one of the lucky ones going to convo, Jacko?

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Old 02-11-2018, 10:49 PM   #298
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Woops! Haven't really been following your politics threads and posts, but I should've guessed the article would get your candle to flame up even in the snow! Lucky you, Jacko, to be surrounded by so much snow! God bless America, God bless all the continents; our little planet earth and our universe! And thank you, God, for snow!

Just wondering, my husband says he doesn't want to go to Los Angeles because there are 3 million people below the poverty line. Is this social justice marxism or just another of maya's obstacles so I don't get to convocation? (or maybe just a fear of planes) lol

Surely Guruji never intended for us to have the same political opinions? People from different cultures, countries, languages and religions all coming together and meditating in silence, mentally bowing before God and Guru....

....quite a miracle! A first-timer from France told us about her experience at convocation....all these noisy, friendly Americans and others, and then suddenly a room of complete silence and hundreds of people meditating...just extraordinary!

Long live different political opinions - as long as we meditate and keep thoughts of peace upper most!

Love you all!
IDF
PS. Are you one of the lucky ones going to convo, Jacko?
Everything is Maya in this physical universe.

Even the Gurus were subject to Maya, and although freeer than us, could not escape from its influence all the time.

Master had certain political opinions. He was not just "open" and supportive of certain political opinions.

The leader of N. Korea has certain political opinions and unleashed wild hungry dogs on his uncle for violating them.

Should we thank God that he has the right to have his political opinion?

The point is, that some political views institute evil and misery for the people.

The Guru supported the U.S. military against N. Korea in the 1950s Korean war for example.

If our views become all encompassing then anything goes.

Another way of saying that is, if you don't stand for something, you will fall for anything. SO what will you stand for? What will you fall for?

etc. etc. etc.

Everyone is a soul with a spiritual eye. Hitler O. Bin Laden and Stalin were souls with spiritual eyes. Should we embrace them then?

We have to work for political views and systems which benefit all and alleviate suffering and want in this plane of existence. How that can be done takes compassion and common sense.

Would you open your front door and let anyone into your house off the street?
There was a girl in SRF who did that very thing and she was raped and murdered by the person she was trying to help.

A similar vigilance is needed when creating and allowing social and political systems to be implemented.
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Old 02-11-2018, 11:22 PM   #299
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"It is never a question of belief; the only scientific attitude one can take on any subject is whether it is true. The law of gravitation worked as efficiently before Newton as after him. The cosmos would be fairly chaotic if its laws could not operate without the sanction of human belief."

~ Sriyukteswar
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Old 02-12-2018, 01:27 PM   #300
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Sorry folks, if you found me a little uncaring. Do continue.
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Old 02-12-2018, 03:29 PM   #301
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Sorry folks, if you found me a little uncaring. Do continue.
I rather go on watching a documentary about Beethoven's life, such a terrible marxist he was and he even dared to write great uplifting music. :-)
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Old 02-12-2018, 06:57 PM   #302
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I rather go on watching a documentary about Beethoven's life, such a terrible marxist he was and he even dared to write great uplifting music. :-)

Lol.. I dont know what sort of 'documentary' you watched, but you do realize that Marx was just 9 years old when Beethoven died? Beethoven was a Catholic who prayed to God often, and who was in favour of Napoleonic rule. Marxists, as a rule, tend to take their queue from Marx's life's work for one, and tend to be atheists second. Just because Beethoven did not pander to the snobbish behaviour of the bourgeois didnt make him a Marxist (or anything like Marx).
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Old 02-13-2018, 03:16 AM   #303
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Lol.. I dont know what sort of 'documentary' you watched, but you do realize that Marx was just 9 years old when Beethoven died?
Master's 'people with the same kind of craziness' pops up when you least expect it.

What are the odds? I've not heard a single devotee go off on a Marxism tangent, and suddenly there are two.

Oops... Picasso was a Marxist? Oh well... bonus points if you know the name of the horse.
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Old 02-13-2018, 03:59 AM   #304
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JOL:

The great deceiver:

"Cultural Marxism is spiritual, even under a different banner."

and among some SRF members:

"It's part of the Dwapara Yuga enlightenment evolution" - :-(

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Old 02-13-2018, 05:46 AM   #305
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Master's 'people with the same kind of craziness' pops up when you least expect it.

What are the odds? I've not heard a single devotee go off on a Marxism tangent, and suddenly there are two.

Oops... Picasso was a Marxist? Oh well... bonus points if you know the name of the horse.
Pray tell, what has this got to do with Beethoven not being a Marxist? If there is a connection, you may have to dumb it down some for me. Some of us seem to have difficulty keeping up with the general confusion and deflection being exhibited on the subject in this thread.

If making mock analogies to iconic characters is your bag, Im sure you'll appreciate the mental image that immediately comes to mind about a few of you collectively qualifying as Larry, Curly and Mo'.

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Old 02-13-2018, 05:46 AM   #306
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JOL:

The great deceiver:

"Cultural Marxism is spiritual, even under a different banner."

and among some SRF members:

"It's part of the Dwapara Yuga enlightenment evolution" - :-(
You do realize he is being sarcastic about the great irony implicit in the beliefs of devotees if they happen to be leftists (especially without appearing to grasp why they may be so inclined)? If you dont, it explains much.
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Old 02-13-2018, 07:30 AM   #307
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Master's 'people with the same kind of craziness' pops up when you least expect it.

What are the odds? I've not heard a single devotee go off on a Marxism tangent, and suddenly there are two.

Oops... Picasso was a Marxist? Oh well... bonus points if you know the name of the horse.
I happen to know quite a few devotees not on this board who also recognize the perplexing weirdness of following SRF teachings while steeped in liberal ideology. Here's a sample of what one of them said in a recent FB post:


"It is astounding to me that so many devotees praise the liberals; the ones who promote abortion, a ruling class, no transparency of our police (FBI), reduced religous rights, and other tyrannical ideologies.

It is also astounding that they would spew hatred towards our president!

How do they reconcile such obvious conflicts?

I ask myself "what am I missing?" because I love my fellows on this wonderful path of light and love. I ask them directly, too. But all I get back is more distractions or hysteria.

Wake up! The liberal movement is no longer about civil rights or ending war; those days are over. The liberal path is about socialism and tyranny."
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:21 AM   #308
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Pray tell, what has this got to do with Beethoven not being a Marxist? If there is a connection, you may have to dumb it down some for me. Some of us seem to have difficulty keeping up with the general confusion and deflection being exhibited on the subject in this thread.
The 'connection' is that you're so wrapped up in your self-spun Marxist web that you can't tell when someone is making fun of it.

There's a place for poliitics, but to assign such supreme importance to that field as you seem to be doing would have to qualify as rather unique in my experience with devotees.

US politics these days is mostly just a play of divide-and-conquer. Have you ever seen America more divided? The two sides hardly even talk to each other anymore, so convinced they each are of their own superior views. What is more likely: that they're both 'right' or both missing the point? The question is who benefits from such division. I merely note that the same corporate fascist machine has been rolling on for decades, and it's not stopping under the current president. I can tell you that much. Military spending will be at new highs, and he wants a parade as cherry on top.

Do you know how much good could be done with that money instead? Roll over Beethoven. The founding fathers are spinning in their graves.
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:36 AM   #309
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The 'connection' is that you're so wrapped up in your self-spun Marxist web that you can't tell when someone is making fun of it.

There's a place for poliitics, but to assign such supreme importance to that field as you seem to be doing would have to qualify as rather unique in my experience with devotees.

US politics these days is mostly just a play of divide-and-conquer. Have you ever seen America more divided? The two sides hardly even talk to each other anymore, so convinced they each are of their own superior views. What is more likely: that they're both 'right' or both missing the point? The question is who benefits from such division. I merely note that the same corporate fascist machine has been rolling on for decades, and it's not stopping under the current president. I can tell you that much. Military spending will be at new highs, and he wants a parade as cherry on top.

Do you know how much good could be done with that money instead? Roll over Beethoven. The founding fathers are spinning in their graves.
More indications of Leftist influence on your thinking that you accept as normal and holy.

This is the same mentality used in the 1960s by the "New Left" to undermine the U.S, military in Vietnam which caused the withdraw of the USA military and the death of millions of Vietnamese by North Vietnam, and I have met some Vietnamese who escaped the Communist terror that followed the US withdraw so please, no sanctimonious lectures on the virtues of non-violence, which the New Left pushed.
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Old 02-13-2018, 08:53 AM   #310
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The 'connection' is that you're so wrapped up in your self-spun Marxist web that you can't tell when someone is making fun of it.

There's a place for poliitics, but to assign such supreme importance to that field as you seem to be doing would have to qualify as rather unique in my experience with devotees.

US politics these days is mostly just a play of divide-and-conquer. Have you ever seen America more divided? The two sides hardly even talk to each other anymore, so convinced they each are of their own superior views. What is more likely: that they're both 'right' or both missing the point? The question is who benefits from such division. I merely note that the same corporate fascist machine has been rolling on for decades, and it's not stopping under the current president. I can tell you that much. Military spending will be at new highs, and he wants a parade as cherry on top.

Do you know how much good could be done with that money instead? Roll over Beethoven. The founding fathers are spinning in their graves.
That I or JoL, or anyone else attach 'supreme importance' to it is, as with other opinions of yours espoused here, a highly subjective viewpoint. Its a fairly obvious charge to make, attacking as it does a devotee's alleged lack of being 'spiritual enough' by not being above such petty concerns. However I would suggest instead that you hide behind this sense of what an established spirituality ought to look like, for all intents and purposes, and its perhaps indicative of a lack of what Sriyukteswar described as 'spiritual perceptions not being incapacitating'. One can certainly seek to cultivate the state of 'head high in the heavens, yet feet planted firmly on earth.' As I said earlier in the thread, if the masters themselves are able to distinguish how 'spiritual socialism' stands as the antithesis of Marxism, and make specific comments about the absence of spirituality in the selfishness and materialism of western conceptions of socialism, there is obviously something legitimately reasonable in their observations that can be applied to current political trends in the US and elsewhere.

'Self-spun' is a fairly self-serving narrative on your part, considering there is a wide ranging sense of consensus about the real presence and threat of the cultural Marxism being practised in the political arena by the modern left, as recognized by a significant, and growing proportion of the population.

The comments you make about US politics (even though the cultural Marxism of the left is a global issue) hold no small tinge of irony for me because you are actually echoing some of the main criticisms of big government made by libertarians. Its just that an informed view also recognizes that Trump's election, as imperfect a model of an ideal presidential figure as he may be, nevertheless displaced much of the 'shoe-in' and carry-over that the left seeks to impose on US citizens, and through the influence of US exceptionalism, upon the rest of the world. His election was a straight up derailment, for the time being, of the leftist agenda, and though he is not a true libertarian, he certainly became the focal point of many Americans' inevitable dissatisfaction with that agenda.

The concerns held by conservatives who happen to be devotees (as with conservatives and especially libertarians in general), about the significant portion of society who support liberal politics and policies, seemingly unaware of their true import (duped by the superficial facade of 'identity politics' that is the hallmark of the left), are fairly widespread, I can assure you. That you say you havent come across them being expressed with such vehemence before isnt really relevant or successfully dismissive of the veracity of such views. Perhaps because of the level of unabashed ignorance surrounding the issue, and the level of indoctrination reflected in a cross section of devotees, much like the rest of the country and indeed the world, its merely a sign of the degree to which you and so many others are susceptible to the leftist agenda you unknowingly subscribe to, and which runs counter to the spiritual values you simultaneously espouse.

When you repeatedly express leftist viewpoints that undeniably have their origin in objectively established Marxist dialectic, then tie them in vaguely with spurious connections to spiritual teachings without batting an eye lid, you can be sure there will be others who cant help but see that kind of cognitive dissonance and want to point it out, if not for your own benefit, then for others' benefit. Sometimes it also needs to be said simply because it is true.

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Old 02-13-2018, 04:11 PM   #311
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More indications of Leftist influence on your thinking that you accept as normal and holy.

This is the same mentality used in the 1960s by the "New Left" to undermine the U.S, military in Vietnam which caused the withdraw of the USA military and the death of millions of Vietnamese by North Vietnam, and I have met some Vietnamese who escaped the Communist terror that followed the US withdraw so please, no sanctimonious lectures on the virtues of non-violence, which the New Left pushed.
JoL,
actually a great cause of the defeat of the USA in Vietnam was the wrong strategy by General Westmoreland, with its forced relocation of whole villages and body count.
North vietnamese couldn't care less that they lost 10 times as much soldiers as the Americans ans S vietnamese. They did not value life much and westmoreland's concept turned out to be a failure.
Also, the Mai Lai massacre was what turned the general public opinion in America against the war. Before, it was the leftists in an obnoxious way. After that, it was nearly everyone and with founded reasons.
American soldiers killing unarmed women and kids in a village was probably what ended that war.

There is no excuse for the Vietnam defeat. The leftists were obnoxious but they did not govern.
Proper ownership must be recognized, in defeat and in victory.

I'll add that SRF did not allow aspiring monks to avoid the draft in Vietnam. SRF thought that fighting in vietnam was a duty even for the young men who wanted to lead a monastic life.
Daya Mata believed that it was an holy duty and honour to fight for America and for freedom from satanic materialistic communism.
Was the great Daya Mata suffering a huge delusion?
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Old 02-13-2018, 06:08 PM   #312
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JoL,
actually a great cause of the defeat of the USA in Vietnam was the wrong strategy by General Westmoreland, with its forced relocation of whole villages and body count.
North vietnamese couldn't care less that they lost 10 times as much soldiers as the Americans ans S vietnamese. They did not value life much and westmoreland's concept turned out to be a failure.
Also, the Mai Lai massacre was what turned the general public opinion in America against the war. Before, it was the leftists in an obnoxious way. After that, it was nearly everyone and with founded reasons.
American soldiers killing unarmed women and kids in a village was probably what ended that war.

There is no excuse for the Vietnam defeat. The leftists were obnoxious but they did not govern.
Proper ownership must be recognized, in defeat and in victory.

I'll add that SRF did not allow aspiring monks to avoid the draft in Vietnam. SRF thought that fighting in vietnam was a duty even for the young men who wanted to lead a monastic life.
Daya Mata believed that it was an holy duty and honour to fight for America and for freedom from satanic materialistic communism.
Was the great Daya Mata suffering a huge delusion?
McCoy, no doubt there were strategic errors as in every war. Also, with regimes who, as you say, don't value life much, using innocents as sacrificial lambs is a common tactic, just like the jihadists who put missile launchers in hospitals so if they are attacked can claim the "brutal inhumanity" of their opponents, which the world media will gladly broadcast.

Still, to turn the minds and hearts of a citizen population against its own military is a potent psychological weapon, and the Leftist activists of the 60s knew that well. The word "fascist" was a common pejorative thrown around by the Leftists back then, among many others, still used today to demonize any policy or action which strengthens the U.S. position in the world. There were communists among those protestors you know, and still are today, wherever you see protests opposing U.S. policy on just about every issue. By the way, "professor Obama" was steeped heavily in and embraced that Leftist view on the USA, which is, "The USA is the big problem in the world". . Then, any methodology or political action to weaken the U.S. and thwart its influence, becomes noble and righteous.
Unfortunately, the bad actors in the world see this, and jump on the bandwagon, to move the world mind on their side, claiming victim status mostly.
Right now, N.Korea is working feverishly to get those ICBM nukes up and running, so they sent the propaganda minister to the Olympics to charm the world media, and being so liberal and left leaning, the media took the bait.
That sways the world opinion to their side, as it is suppose to do.

Wonder what Daya Ma would say about all this, or even Master?

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Old 02-14-2018, 02:26 AM   #313
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I shall only join in the debate when I'm retired, as to know what Marxism is one should read him, I've had a peak and have decided it will be too time consuming, and I need to meditate more, I'm still working on keeping the spiritual uppermost.....

But in the mean time, a Q for Jacko: what do you think of the kibbutz? or is such a small community not comparable in your mind...?
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Old 02-14-2018, 02:50 AM   #314
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I shall only join in the debate when I'm retired, as to know what Marxism is one should read him, I've had a peak and have decided it will be too time consuming
http://magazines.odisha.gov.in/Oriss...gpdf/37-41.pdf
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Old 02-14-2018, 11:05 AM   #315
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Thank you for posting, Khitomer.
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Old 02-17-2018, 10:39 PM   #316
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I happen to know quite a few devotees not on this board who also recognize the perplexing weirdness of following SRF teachings while steeped in liberal ideology. Here's a sample of what one of them said in a recent FB post:


"It is astounding to me that so many devotees praise the liberals; the ones who promote abortion, a ruling class, no transparency of our police (FBI), reduced religous rights, and other tyrannical ideologies.

It is also astounding that they would spew hatred towards our president!

How do they reconcile such obvious conflicts?

I ask myself "what am I missing?" because I love my fellows on this wonderful path of light and love. I ask them directly, too. But all I get back is more distractions or hysteria.

Wake up! The liberal movement is no longer about civil rights or ending war; those days are over. The liberal path is about socialism and tyranny."
Yes, I see a strong preponderance of liberals who follow yoga and eastern religions. I have sensed it a great deal in ananda as well which has a very strong online presence but SRF possibly also. Ananda arose out of San Francisco which is one of the most liberal places on earth. I see this a bit as well in the Yuga concept as it seems like it is saying the higher ages are going to be liberal. I tried to read a JDW book on yugas but I just can't manage it and it is highly subjective. I am a little conflicted because I see myself as partly conservative but also largely a moderate. The Yuga stuff makes some sense but I guess you can look at it all kinds of ways and the way some people put it I just don't know. It may be one reason why I sometimes like to hang around conservative Christian churches once in awhile even though I disagree with them on some issues. I also like bible scriptures as I see them as less liberal. I have had to remind myself that yogananda was different than many of his followers.
Despite having said that I would still go to or have gone in the past on some ocassions to SRF or ananda services which are a bit of a drive but I may go in the summer
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Old 02-18-2018, 02:00 AM   #317
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(snipped)

US politics these days is mostly just a play of divide-and-conquer. Have you ever seen America more divided? The two sides hardly even talk to each other anymore, so convinced they each are of their own superior views. What is more likely: that they're both 'right' or both missing the point? The question is who benefits from such division.
So, Russia it was. and continues to sow the seeds of discontent and division. What is the game they are playing and why?

They were clearly scared of Hillary making President. How does having Trump at the helm, further their agenda?

Somehow just lifting of US sanctions against them seems too minor an objective for orchestrating this detailed plan to subvert elections since 2014. There is something more sinister at the heart of this interference. What could it be? Why would a communist country support and encourage a conservative candidate?

Something seems amiss, and no reports or articles I have come across so far touch upon the real motive of the Russians.
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Old 02-18-2018, 04:18 PM   #318
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So, Russia it was. and continues to sow the seeds of discontent and division. What is the game they are playing and why?

They were clearly scared of Hillary making President. How does having Trump at the helm, further their agenda?

Somehow just lifting of US sanctions against them seems too minor an objective for orchestrating this detailed plan to subvert elections since 2014. There is something more sinister at the heart of this interference. What could it be? Why would a communist country support and encourage a conservative candidate?

Something seems amiss, and no reports or articles I have come across so far touch upon the real motive of the Russians.
Something is amiss, but things are often not what they seem.

I never bought that story of Russian interference. When it first surfaced, in a presidential debate, it seemed a desperate, and somewhat comical, attempt by Hillary Clinton to get the spotlight off her e-mail scandal.

Look into the petrodollar wars for greater insight into the economic camp that Clinton is part of. This camp insists on an artificially created demand for the dollar, which maintains the value of the dollar. This dynamic is unsustainable in the long run. After taking out Saddam and Gaddafi, both of whom directly threatened the petrodollar's hegemony, the next 'Hitler' (for not playing along) in the crosshairs was Putin. The war drums were getting louder each day, but Putin understood the dynamic and had aligned himself with China. The west tried hard to provoke Russia and to set traps, but the 'bear' did not bite.

Donald Trump is not in the petrodollar camp, and therefore doesn't see Russia as a threat. This is a good thing, because America can't compete, in the longer run, with other nations based on a 'money changers' scheme as the petrodollar.

At present, under Trump, the US is in a transition, away from the petrodollar and back towards becoming a manufacturing nation. Once that transition is complete, the American economy can thrive again, but in the meantime there will be many awkward moments as Trump withdraws the US from internatiional trade agreements that didn't benefit the American worker (but that the US could afford under the petrodollar scheme). America doesn't need the petrodollar, but those in its camp won't easily step aside.

I believe, or hope, this to be the essence of the Trump presidency. Outside of that theme, it's pretty much a mess, but the theme itself is important enough to see it through. Trump understands money, and he can see that China is positioning itself as a formidable world power. The US will not be able to compete with China based on the petrodollar, because China has been at work on undermining its power (by offering a gold-backed currency, where the dollar is just printed paper backed by military might). So the US has no other option but to return to becoming a manufacturing nation.
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Old 02-19-2018, 12:13 AM   #319
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The FBI investigation said the Russian personnel, though unconnectable to the Russian government, only ended up trying to help the Trump campaign and working against the Hillary campaign. But that was only eventually. Initially they worked against the Trump campaign, and supported the Hillary campaign. There was also no evidence of collusion between Trump and the Russians.


https://www.dailywire.com/news/27248...iro#exit-modal


"In a statement that is sending shockwaves through the political world, a spokesman for General Counsel Robert Mueller's Russia probe announced on Friday that the counsel's 37-page indictment of Russians and Russian entities for interference in U.S. elections does not contain any allegation against any American for knowingly participating in the meddling.

"There is no allegation in this indictment that any American was a knowing participant in this illegal activity," Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein said at a press conference on Friday.

Rosenstein also underscored that the investigation found no evidence that the alleged Russian meddling impacted the 2016 election, a common claim of many Democrats, including Hillary Clinton.

"There is no allegation in the indictment that the charged conduct altered the outcome of the 2016 election," Rosenstein told reporters.

The indictment singles out 13 Russians and three Russian entities for "allegedly conduct[ing] what they called 'information warfare' against the United States," Rosenstein explained. That alleged "information warfare" was conducted between 2014 and 2016.

Rosenstein made the comment in response to one reporter asking him about references to the Trump campaign in the indictment. "On page four of the indictment, paragraph six, it specifically talks about the Trump campaign, saying that defendants communicated with unwitting individuals associated with the Trump campaign," said the reporter. "My question is later in the indictment, campaign officials are referenced not by their name, by campaign official one or two or three. Were campaign officials cooperative or were they duped? What was their relationship with this?"

"There is no allegation in the indictment that any American was a knowing participant in the alleged unlawful activity," Rosenstein responded. "There is no allegation in the indictment that the charged conduct altered the outcome of the 2016 election."

As Daily Wire editor-in-chief Ben Shapiro puts it, the special counsel's indictment just seriously undercut the key premise of the Russia collusion narrative. Here's a section from the indictment on Russian sources' attempts to contact the Trump campaign:

Some Defendants, posing as US persons and without revealing their Russian association, communicated with unwitting individuals associated with the Trump Campaign and with other political activists to seek to coordinate political activities.

"Collusion only counts if you know you’re soliciting help from foreign sources," writes Shapiro. "Those involved with the Trump campaign apparently didn't. That blows a rather large hole in the theory that the Russians were working hand-in-glove with Trump campaign officials."

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Old 02-19-2018, 09:06 PM   #320
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The FBI investigation said the Russian personnel, though unconnectable to the Russian government, only ended up trying to help the Trump campaign and working against the Hillary campaign. But that was only eventually. Initially they worked against the Trump campaign, and supported the Hillary campaign. There was also no evidence of collusion between Trump and the Russians.
There is no mention of them supporting Hillary's campaign in the 37-page mueller report.

My query has nothing to do with whether Trump or any US citizen knowingly colluded with Russia or not. That is secondary.

Since 2014, money, time, personnel, resources were devoted on a large scale in a systematic manner to affect the outcome of 2016 elections. Tracks were covered well and had it not been for intensive investigation by the FBI, this (russian meddling) might have passed off as just another conspiracy theory. This widespread exercise is not the handiwork of some individuals working suo moto.

It is abundantly clear that Russia did not want Hillary at the helm. She was a threat of sorts. Capitalist Trump wasn't perceived as a threat and for that matter neither was socialist Sanders. Perhaps petrodollar could have been at the heart of this.
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